Curse

Chocobo1 · Nov 22, 2009, 03:19 AM // 03:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoyon456

UW wasn't hard. I have beaten it many times since 2006 when I began playing, always balanced or some group build that didn't abuse the preferred farming method of the time.

The new updates, combined with the difficulty of Dhuum itself is the problem. It's been mentioned before, but someone in Anet is on drugs if in order to reduce UWSC, they thought first making it difficult for ALL teams and then nerfing Shadow Form a month later (behind schedule I might add) was a bright idea.

I really don't care about the minis, and although I wouldn't mind the scythe, I'd really just like to clear UW/Dhuum, or at least fight him, without having to roll an SF sin or grab my monk and get in an SF group. I'm not saying its impossible to do this now, but its certainly not probable. Its counterproductive to nerf UWSC time, but make it so in order to have a good chance of clearing, its best to run an SF group.

They've actually set a definite date for nerfing Shadow Form?

AlsPals · Nov 22, 2009, 03:55 AM // 03:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chocobo1

They've actually set a definite date for nerfing Shadow Form?

Almost, kinda sorta. I myself have never finished UW in one go(did 2 of the quests with just me and 3 heroes once...) and can feel the argument of some. "Get friends or a guild together" people say. That was a viable option until both started quitting the game or moving to PvP. Then you get people in pugs who are terrible. On the other hand, get good people who always have to leave in the middle of your run for whatever reason. Easier said than done, people.

Kerwyn Nasilan · Nov 22, 2009, 04:04 AM // 04:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Abedeus

"- We don't like this, this, or this in the game. Please, if you could fix it, we would be grateful. This would really improve the game.

The number of responses in this vein are few

Shadowspawn X · Nov 22, 2009, 04:04 AM // 04:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoyon456

The new updates, combined with the difficulty of Dhuum itself is the problem. It's been mentioned before, but someone in Anet is on drugs if in order to reduce UWSC, they thought first making it difficult for ALL teams and then nerfing Shadow Form a month later (behind schedule I might add) was a bright idea.

Fair enough, but if we leave the SF/UWSC discussion out of it the update was good. PvE skills and power creep alone demanded the area be buffed. A few new wrinkles in the quests puts the difficulty level back where it was in 2006. I can't QQ about the update itself. But describing it as a answer to UWSC is fail on Anets part.

draxynnic · Nov 22, 2009, 07:00 AM // 07:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlsPals

"Get friends or a guild together" people say. That was a viable option until both started quitting the game or moving to PvP. Then you get people in pugs who are terrible. On the other hand, get good people who always have to leave in the middle of your run for whatever reason. Easier said than done, people.

Pretty much my problem, too. *shrugs*

FoxBat · Nov 22, 2009, 07:43 AM // 07:43

You "need" ONE person to play paragon, everyone else can roll whatever they want. Same thing that lets bad balanced teams stroll through any other area.

Feathermoore Rep · Nov 22, 2009, 08:25 AM // 08:25

not true. you don't need a para for shit. you do however need some sort of a tank for uw (4H + imprisioned). With the addition of skeles, its pretty much impossible to fight 4h at the reaper. 4 skeles just put out to much everything ignoring dmg to sit there. So one way or another you have to gank one-side then fall back to the other. With imprisioned its much much more important that you quickly gank the random new spawn of 2 or 3 dryders and 2 dhuums that come from behind and rape the spirits. While someone else holds off the other sides till those guys are done.

UW wouldnt be that hard for balanced with no permas, no 600s, no imbagons, and no cons if skeles did not exist. As it stands now, you pretty much need a perma just to stand there for two quests if nothing else. its not fun. i understand SF being usefull for bad people to complete things they otherwise wouldnt be able to, but if decent players can't beat an elite area with a balanced team in at least normal mode without resorting to permas, 600s, imbagons, or cons, then its not fair or fun.

The only way I've come close to completing the UW with none of that is with a brave spirit spammer holding off one side of the 4h quest. The new wastes really isnt that hard. just make sure you spread out and gank out the couple skeles that spawn with the quest. We lost at pits, because i didn't realize yet that there was a new spawn of terrors and skeles that come from the back side and attack the spirits.

I mean i understand the need to stop speed clears with 8 sins, but adding groups of 1-4 skeletons that have a spirit-range aoe spell that deals 35dmg/s for 3 sec and a 100 dmg bone spike, thats everything ignoring was not the best solution for everyone. Because i love having to try to compete with massive amount of non-preventable dmg, just because you couldnt come up with a way to stop shadowform otherwise. So not only does balanced have to be able to spike down multiple skeles really quickly, but it has to be able to out heal 100dmg party wide dmg over 3 seconds per skele + normal foes. Its just ridiculous.

I understand GW gets harder by pumping out bigger numbers from monsters, but practically forcing us to use cons or a gimmick to win isn't cool. I dont care that it could take me 3 hours to beat UW with balanced, the fact that i could was fun team experience.

Joe Fierce · Nov 22, 2009, 08:31 AM // 08:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Feathermoore Rep

not true. you don't need a para for shit. you do however need some sort of a tank for uw (4H + imprisioned). With the addition of skeles, its pretty much impossible to fight 4h at the reaper. 4 skeles just put out to much everything ignoring dmg to sit there. So one way or another you have to gank one-side then fall back to the other. With imprisioned its much much more important that you quickly gank the random new spawn of 2 or 3 dryders and 2 dhuums that come from behind and rape the spirits. While someone else holds off the other sides till those guys are done.

UW wouldnt be that hard for balanced with no permas, no 600s, no imbagons, and no cons if skeles did not exist. As it stands now, you pretty much need a perma just to stand there for two quests if nothing else. its not fun. i understand SF being usefull for bad people to complete things they otherwise wouldnt be able to, but if decent players can't beat an elite area with a balanced team in at least normal mode without resorting to permas, 600s, imbagons, or cons, then its not fair or fun.

The only way I've come close to completing the UW with none of that is with a brave spirit spammer holding off one side of the 4h quest. The new wastes really isnt that hard. just make sure you spread out and gank out the couple skeles that spawn with the quest. We lost at pits, because i didn't realize yet that there was a new spawn of terrors and skeles that come from the back side and attack the spirits.

I mean i understand the need to stop speed clears with 8 sins, but adding groups of 1-4 skeletons that have a spirit-range aoe spell that deals 35dmg/s for 3 sec and a 100 dmg bone spike, thats everything ignoring was not the best solution for everyone. Because i love having to try to compete with massive amount of non-preventable dmg, just because you couldnt come up with a way to stop shadowform otherwise. So not only does balanced have to be able to spike down multiple skeles really quickly, but it has to be able to out heal 100dmg party wide dmg over 3 seconds per skele + normal foes. Its just ridiculous.

I understand GW gets harder by pumping out bigger numbers from monsters, but practically forcing us to use cons or a gimmick to win isn't cool. I dont care that it could take me 3 hours to beat UW with balanced, the fact that i could was fun team experience.

You think 4H is a problem now for balanced, give servants of grenth a whirl.

Abedeus · Nov 22, 2009, 09:30 AM // 09:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kerwyn Nasilan

The number of responses in this vein are few

Yeah, there are a lot more of the second responses.

drkn · Nov 22, 2009, 09:32 AM // 09:32

i'm not worried about the necessity of using cons. it's kinda good addition if you view it other way. the cons are there, available to everyone (if you don't have eotn, you can just buy the cons from someone). if cons were not 'required', the usage of them would spoil the fun and make the whole run too easy. so you are 'required' to use them to level out the difficulty, as otherwise it would just be too easy with them.

we haven't used cons for the most part and completed everything but wastes and pits; failed at pits cause of new skeles spawn, they've just killed the spirits too fast. but other than that, it was fine, no one was even dying too much.
we have used a permasin there, but basically just for one side at 4h, something a terra ele can handle as well, or even a decent spiritmancer in nm. to spice things up, we've used a main dervish tank just to see how it works and it worked well.

if you know the new spawns, if your monks and other backup do their job, if you have a decent blocker (for 4h and dragging some mobs away - perma/terra/spirit/whatever works) and if you have enough damage output to kill the mobs, you can do it. the biggest issue now is, as it seems, the new spawns tbh.